[EL] Beyond Words

Fri Apr 24 12:08:55 PDT 2015

Thank you, Steve, for posting the link earlier in a very germane sort of
way.

Because of the unfortunate rise in politics becoming criminalized, people's
lives are being demolished due to the ruse of campaign finance reform.
Some of us concerned about constitutional and civil rights see this as a
turning point against the inherent vice of reform measures that silence,
censor, and jail people for engaging the political process.  Like
misconceived censorship pushes of the past--film licensing and defamation
laws come to mind--campaign finance is, thankfully, on the correct
trajectory to its sizable elimination.  Examples like that in Wisconsin, or
cases I've been involved with in other parts of the nation, show how reform
actually works and help speed it toward its demise.

Americans are moving toward great policy breakthroughs that embrace liberty
and protect civil rights just now.  Drug reform and civil asset forfeiture
are two recent examples of Americans being fed up.  Heavy-handed
enforcement, bizarre regulatory priorities, and inherent injustices have
helped these movements grow.  As it were with these, so too shall it be
with the criminalization of politics.

Forward,

Benjamin Barr
General Counsel
Pillar of Law Institute

On Fri, Apr 24, 2015 at 2:47 PM, Steve Hoersting <hoersting at gmail.com>
wrote:

> But "evidence," Kevin, is exactly what the speech advocates on the
> listserv are trying keep part of our political discourse. Silencing,
> however purportedly noble its goal, is anathema to human interaction.
>
> We've been trying to tell ya this for years. It *is* the point; not
> beside it.
>
> I wish you a good weekend, as well,
>
> Steve
>
> On Fri, Apr 24, 2015 at 2:35 PM, Greenberg, Kevin <
> Kevin.Greenberg at flastergreenberg.com> wrote:
>
>>  Look, this is a great mailing list to discuss interesting issues and
>> share news.  It includes academics, paid partisans, practitioners,
>> journalists, commentators, even some unfortunate government employees who
>> are now purging their saved emails. (A JOKE people)
>>
>>
>>
>> But we get off topic and tend to personify differences when we get into
>> simply posting “evidence” of what our side believes.  What I have seen is
>> that this is particularly true when the facts pertain to issues being fully
>> litigated in forums that, frankly, are not driven by the nuances of law.
>>
>>
>>
>> I’d hate to see this newsgroup to devolve even further to become a
>> republication platform for every half-truth, allegation, and Fox News story
>> that touches in any way on election law.  If I’m overstepping, Rick, tell
>> me and I’ll back off.  But absent the owner’s intervention, I want to ask
>> folks to dial back the partisan sharing just a little bit.  Please.
>>
>>
>>
>> And this seems to happen almost every Friday.  Please take a deep breath,
>> enjoy the weekend, and share something more immediately germane with us.
>> From all perspectives.
>>
>>
>>
>> Kevin
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* law-election-bounces at department-lists.uci.edu [mailto:
>> law-election-bounces at department-lists.uci.edu] *On Behalf Of *Smith, Brad
>> *Sent:* Friday, April 24, 2015 1:07 PM
>> *To:* Tyler Culberson
>>
>> *Cc:* law-election at uci.edu
>> *Subject:* Re: [EL] Beyond Words
>>
>>
>>
>> whoa boy. Maybe everyone should slow down.
>>
>>
>>
>> Here is Stuart Taylor on the alleged "death threat":
>> http://legalnewsline.com/news/252276-whistleblower-mulling-libel-suit-against-milwaukee-newspaper-over-death-threat-claim
>>
>>
>>
>> What I would hope we could all agree on is that midnight raids in force
>> were totally unnecessary in this case, and should call into question
>> something -- Chisholm's motives; runaway, militarized police forces
>> generally; the advisability of the John Doe procedure generally or its
>> specific use here-- something.
>>
>>
>>
>> *Bradley A. Smith*
>>
>> *Josiah H. Blackmore II/Shirley M. Nault*
>>
>> *   Professor of Law*
>>
>> *Capital University Law School*
>>
>> *303 E. Broad St.*
>>
>> *Columbus, OH 43215*
>>
>> *614.236.6317 <614.236.6317>*
>>
>> *http://law.capital.edu/faculty/bios/bsmith.aspx
>> <http://law.capital.edu/faculty/bios/bsmith.aspx>*
>>   ------------------------------
>>
>> *From:* law-election-bounces at department-lists.uci.edu [
>> law-election-bounces at department-lists.uci.edu] on behalf of Tyler
>> Culberson [tylerculberson at gmail.com]
>> *Sent:* Friday, April 24, 2015 12:15 PM
>> *To:* Steve Hoersting
>> *Cc:* law-election at uci.edu
>> *Subject:* Re: [EL] Beyond Words
>>
>> Steve,
>>
>> What I find unpleasant is the fact that the police officer interviewed by
>> Megyn Kelly, Michael Lutz, in the link you provide, along side Eric O'Keefe
>> the head of Wisconsin Club for Growth, had issued a death threat
>> <http://www.jsonline.com/watchdog/noquarter/source-who-accused-chisholm-of-vendetta-has-troubled-past-b99350187z1-274905441.html>
>> to the prosecutor in question, John Chisholm - raising a certain level of
>> concern over Lutz's credibility. Though, like all good FoxNews reporting,
>> that information was not disclosed during the interview.
>>
>>
>>
>> -Tyler
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Apr 24, 2015 at 11:40 AM, Steve Hoersting <hoersting at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Gentlemen, none of this is pleasant. I grant you.
>>
>>
>>
>> But if you say political retribution is a discussion irrelevant to the
>> matter of remaking or "reforming" our speech protections, I'd say you have
>> a lot to learn.
>>
>>
>>
>> Steve
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Apr 24, 2015 at 11:29 AM, Greenberg, Kevin <
>> Kevin.Greenberg at flastergreenberg.com> wrote:
>>
>> OK, I’m convinced.
>>
>>
>>
>> Seriously, folks, can we focus our posts on relevant information and
>> discussions.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* law-election-bounces at department-lists.uci.edu [mailto:
>> law-election-bounces at department-lists.uci.edu] *On Behalf Of *Steve
>> Hoersting
>> *Sent:* Friday, April 24, 2015 11:19 AM
>> *To:* law-election at uci.edu
>> *Subject:* [EL] Beyond Words
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> http://therightscoop.com/megyn-kelly-interviews-former-cop-who-says-he-knows-wisconsin-raids-were-politically-motivated/
>>
>>
>>
>> A nod to Eric O'Keefe and the Officer for coming forward.
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Stephen M. Hoersting
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Stephen M. Hoersting
>>
>>
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>>
>>
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>
>
>
> --
> Stephen M. Hoersting
>
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