[EL] Quick question about provisional voting in California

Tue Aug 25 21:00:11 PDT 2020

I haven't read through the entire thread, but beginning in the 2018
primary, SB 286 requires polling sites to issue nonprovisional ballots upon
surrender or if the poll book verifies that the VBM has not been
"returned," since it can be marked to prevent the VBM from being
subsequently "cast or tabulated." (amended Section 3015)
This would appear to be a cancellation of the prior ballot for purposes of
Section 18 of the VRA, so a person whose ballot was mailed but not yet
received would not be double voting.
I don't think the emergency rules change that.

Scott Rafferty
1913 Whitecliff Ct
Walnut Creek CA 94596
 mobile 202-380-5525

On Mon, 17 Aug 2020 at 19:11, Douglas Johnson <djohnson at ndcresearch.com>
wrote:

> Capturing just how confusing this all is even for those spending a lot of
> time studying it, the statement that " about 50% of CA voters lived in a
> VCA county where they automatically received a ballot in the mail for the
> primary election" is incorrect. That reflects a common misperception about
> the status of Los Angeles County, which was a pseudo-VCA county. Los
> Angeles set up vote centers rather than traditional precincts, but did NOT
> mail every voter a ballot. Taking Los Angeles out of the count drops that
> percentage from 50% to 25%. (For those not from California, Los Angeles
> County is slightly over 25% of the state's population).
>
> But the statement about 60% of voters being permanent absentees sounds
> correct to me, though I did not double-check that.
>
> - Doug
>
> On Mon, Aug 17, 2020 at 1:45 PM Lisa Bryant <lbryant at csufresno.edu> wrote:
>
>> Yes, "most counties" did not receive ballots automatically, but about 50%
>> of CA voters lived in a VCA county where they automatically received a
>> ballot in the mail for the primary election this year. In those counties,
>> if they didn't take their ballot to the vote center with them the vote
>> center printed a new ballot and voided the mailed ballot. They did not have
>> to vote provisionally.
>>
>> Even prior to VCA, over 60% of registered voters in CA were registered
>> for permanent absentee ballots, as high as 75% in some counties. CA also
>> has a couple of counties that are were exclusively VBM prior to VCA due to
>> small populations and their rural nature.  CA, as a whole, is pretty
>> familiar with VBM and absentee ballots.
>>
>> Best,
>> Lisa
>>
>>
>> Lisa Bryant, Ph.D.
>> Associate Professor, Department of Political Science
>> Survey Director, Institute for Leadership and Public Policy
>> California State University, Fresno
>>
>> On Mon, Aug 17, 2020 at 1:28 PM Douglas Johnson <djohnson at ndcresearch.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> But that primary was an election where in most counties you actively
>>> requested a ballot (either for that election or as a permanent absentee).
>>> This November election millions will get mail ballots they never requested
>>> - will they know to bring them with them to surrender?
>>>
>>> Eric McGhee or Thad Kousser (or anyone from that team), has your
>>> research with the early “Vote Center” counties shown any indications of how
>>> much this is an issue?
>>>
>>> - Doug
>>>
>>> On Mon, Aug 17, 2020 at 12:04 PM Pamela S Karlan <pkarlan at stanford.edu>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Dear Fred and Nate,
>>>>
>>>> If the primary is any indication, at my polling place, it seemed that
>>>> most of us who were voting in person *did* hand in our VBM ballot.
>>>>
>>>> It's interesting that the Secretary of State's website doesn't say
>>>> anything about this.:
>>>> https://www.sos.ca.gov/elections/voting-info/ways-vote/
>>>>
>>>> Pamela S. Karlan
>>>>
>>>> Kenneth and Harle Montgomery Professor of Public Interest Law
>>>>
>>>> Co-Director, Supreme Court Litigation Clinic
>>>>
>>>> Stanford Law School
>>>>
>>>> karlan at stanford.edu
>>>>
>>>> 650-725-4851
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------
>>>> *From:* Law-election <law-election-bounces at department-lists.uci.edu>
>>>> on behalf of Fredric Woocher <fwoocher at strumwooch.com>
>>>> *Sent:* Monday, August 17, 2020 11:52 AM
>>>> *To:* Nate Persily <npersily at law.stanford.edu>; Election Law Listserv <
>>>> law-election at uci.edu>
>>>> *Subject:* Re: [EL] Quick question about provisional voting in
>>>> California
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Nate,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I do not know the answer for certain, but unless the voter hands in the
>>>> unvoted VBM ballot, I don’t see how it could be otherwise.  For those
>>>> counties that will still be using traditional polling places, there is no
>>>> other way for the pollworkers to know whether the voted VBM has already
>>>> been returned prior to casting a ballot at the polling place.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I believe some counties that have the ability to use electronic polling
>>>> books, with real-time countywide information on who has voted and by what
>>>> means, may be able to avoid the use of provisional ballots, but I don’t see
>>>> how that can be avoided in other counties.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> And this has the potential to introduce an additional grounds for
>>>> invalidating the voted ballot, because many people forget to sign their
>>>> provisional ballots in every election.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/10940+Wilshire+Blvd.,+Ste.+2000+%0D%0A+%0D%0A+Los+Angeles,+CA+90024?entry=gmail&source=g>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/10940+Wilshire+Blvd.,+Ste.+2000+%0D%0A+%0D%0A+Los+Angeles,+CA+90024?entry=gmail&source=g>Fredric
>>>> D. Woocher
>>>>
>>>> Strumwasser & Woocher LLP
>>>>
>>>> 10940 Wilshire Blvd., Ste. 2000
>>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/10940+Wilshire+Blvd.,+Ste.+2000+%0D%0A+%0D%0A+Los+Angeles,+CA+90024?entry=gmail&source=g>
>>>>
>>>> Los Angeles, CA 90024
>>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/10940+Wilshire+Blvd.,+Ste.+2000+%0D%0A+%0D%0A+Los+Angeles,+CA+90024?entry=gmail&source=g>
>>>>
>>>> fwoocher at strumwooch.com
>>>>
>>>> (310) 576-1233 x105
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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>>>> Strumwasser & Woocher LLP is CLOSED TO THE PUBLIC.  *Packages
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>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *From:* Law-election [mailto:
>>>> law-election-bounces at department-lists.uci.edu] *On Behalf Of *Nate
>>>> Persily
>>>> *Sent:* Monday, August 17, 2020 11:45 AM
>>>> *To:* Election Law Listserv <law-election at uci.edu>
>>>> *Subject:* [EL] Quick question about provisional voting in California
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Does anyone know if the voters who will choose to vote in person in
>>>> California this November will need to vote a provisional ballot?  That is,
>>>> given that all active registrants will receive ballots in the mail, will
>>>> those who opt for polling places necessarily be casting a provisional
>>>> ballot, rather than a "normal" ballot?
>>>>
>>>> ----------------
>>>>
>>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/559+Nathan+Abbott+Way+%0D%0A+Stanford,+CA+94305-8610?entry=gmail&source=g>
>>>>
>>>> Nate Persily
>>>>
>>>> James B. McClatchy Professor of Law
>>>> Stanford Law School
>>>> 559 Nathan Abbott Way
>>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/559+Nathan+Abbott+Way+%0D%0A+Stanford,+CA+94305-8610?entry=gmail&source=g>
>>>> Stanford, CA 94305-8610
>>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/559+Nathan+Abbott+Way+%0D%0A+Stanford,+CA+94305-8610?entry=gmail&source=g>
>>>> (917) 570-3223
>>>> npersily at stanford.edu
>>>>
>>>> www.persily.com
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>>>
>>> --
>>> Douglas Johnson
>>> National Demographics Corporation
>>> djohnson at NDCresearch.com
>>> phone 310-200-2058
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Law-election mailing list
>>> Law-election at department-lists.uci.edu
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>>
>>
>
> --
> Douglas Johnson
> National Demographics Corporation
> djohnson at NDCresearch.com
> phone 310-200-2058
>
> _______________________________________________
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