Subject: [EL] message from Justin Levitt: Check out FOXNews.com - Citizens' Group Helps Uncover Alleged Rampant Voter F
From: Rick Hasen
Date: 9/25/2010, 3:38 PM
To: Election Law
Reply-to:
"rick.hasen@lls.edu"

Justin was having trouble posting the following to the list:

From: election-law-owner@mailman.lls.edu
Date: September 25, 2010 6:09:15 PM EDT
To: justinmlevitt@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [EL] Check out FOXNews.com - Citizens' Group Helps Uncover Alleged Rampant Voter Fraud

Just three points to add to Mr. Rylander's excellent response, with which I agree. 

First, Jim's original (I know, tongue-in-cheek) exhortation to not bother reading the article is among the worst advice I've heard him give.  In any allegation of fraud, _please_ read the article -- and it's best to check a few other sources too, just to be sure. 

As Jason points out, in this case, you don't have to do much further research  The actual article doesn't support the headline's suggestion of rampant voter fraud in the slightest.  

And that actually makes a slightly different point. Responsible analysts very rarely claim "that there is no such thing as voter fraud." Instead, we (and I like to think I'm in that group) claim that while scattered incidents of real voter fraud do exist, the incidence of voter fraud is vastly overstated by wild and unsupported claims. And that particular statement is nicely supported by the hyperbolic headline of the cited article itself. 

Finally, there are several reasons to believe that any fraudulent registrations uncovered (some of the registrations are indeed likely to be fraudulent, and others are very, very, very likely to be legitimate) won't result in fraudulent votes.  Among these is the fact that fraudulent registration forms submitted by those evaluated for the number of forms they submit have everything to do with individuals shirking on their commitments to the voter registration drive, and nothing whatsoever to do with wanting individuals to try to vote in the name of those registrations. 

But even if you don't believe the incentives (or Jason's point about 24,000 fake voters showing up in one precinct), believe federal law. Every single one of those forms, if submitted by mail, has to be screened under HAVA. Either the driver's license number or the SSN digits on the firm has to match DMV records, or the registrant has to provide some form of ID document (including, but _not_ limited to, specific photo ID).  All before the registrant is allowed to cast a regular ballot. 

There's nothing wrong with people checking up on the rolls, or reporting on people checking up on the rolls, as long as it's done responsibly.  "Citizens' Group Helps Uncover Alleged Rampant Voter Fraud in Houston" isn't even close. 

Justin


--
Justin Levitt
justin@post.harvard.edu

On Sep 25, 2010, at 1:57 PM, Jason Rylander <jasonrylander@gmail.com> wrote:

Voter registration fraud and voter fraud are two different things.  One doesn't necessarily lead to the other.  If those 24,000 phantom voters had shown up at their precinct en masse, you'd think people would have noticed. 

A similar thing happened here in Arlington, VA this year.  A strange coalition of public safety unions, the GOP, and the Green Party attempted to get a change-of-government referendum on the ballot to oust the Democratic county leadership.  They hired out of state petition gatherers in violation of Virginia law.  Their roster included local convicted felons who were themselves ineligible to solicit signatures..  Arlington residents living in a homeless shelter attested to petitions that on their face could not have been circulated by them on the days indicated.  Nearly a third of signatures gathered ended being tossed once the voter registrar became aware of these abnormalities.  The registrar notified the police and Commonwealth's attorney, but alas no arrests have been made.  That's unfortunate.  Of course in the Arlington case, most (but not all) of the actual signatures were legit, it was the mode of solicitation that broke the law.  Still.

The fact is when groups pay people to collect signatures, be it for referenda or for registration, some people will commit fraud (and the problem may not just be limited to paid circulators).  Registrars should really catch examples as egregious as the one in this article. Eternal vigilance is indeed the price of liberty.

But the interesting thing is there is not one sentence in this article suggesting that any person voted multiple times, or voted despite being ineligible, or that the outcome of any election was ever in doubt as a result. 

It's a nice slight of hand that the GOP attempts every election season to cast doubt on the validity of America's elections, but registration irregularities do not necessarily lead to fraudulent votes being cast.  Are such incidents problematic?  Sure.  Can we conclude from this that organized efforts are underway to steal elections?  Not remotely (and in fact it would be a rather difficult conspiracy to carry out in practice).

So, Mr. Bopp, when you get some evidence of actual VOTER fraud, your sarcasm will be warranted.  Until then ...

Regards,
Jason Rylander*

*licensed in DC and Virginia



On Sat, Sep 25, 2010 at 1:14 PM, <JBoppjr@aol.com> wrote:
Click here: FOXNews.com - Citizens' Group Helps Uncover Alleged Rampant Voter Fraud in Houston
 
Don't bother reading this article, because we have been assured that there is no such thing as voter fraud. It is a figment of the GOP's imagination.  No, it is really an effort at voter suppression. In any event, it is Bush's fault (it is Houston after all).  Jim Bopp

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