[EL] Line Standers --not just heroic but Hiatoric
Dan Meek
dan at meek.net
Fri Nov 9 00:02:37 PST 2012
Thomas,
What you describe is very close to the Oregon system: Every voter gets
a ballot in the mail, about 13-17 days before election day, without
requesting it. It can be returned by mail, as long as it is actually
received by the county elections office by 8 p.m. on election day. It
can be deposited into a locked drop box. Multnomah County, which
includes Portland and has a population of 750,000, had 26 drop boxes
this year, most of them at county library branches. But in much of the
state's land area, drop boxes can be 50 miles apart. See
http://progparty.org/Oregon%20Ballot%20Drop%20Sites%202012.htm.
So, for permanent vote-by-mail voters in California, depositing a ballot
on election day is far more convenient than in Oregon, because Oregon
has done away with what used to be thousands of precincts (replacing
them with about 150 drop boxes statewide). Then again, the Oregon system
is no doubt cheaper than California's.
There was also controversy when the State Director of Elections
requested that the U.S. Postal Service not deliver ballots mailed with
insufficient postage. See
http://www.oregonlive.com/mapes/index.ssf/2012/11/in_oregon_secretary_of_states.html.
So the Oregon system needs some fixes, including
1. The State should contract with the U.S. Postal Service to deliver
all ballots without need for affixing postage (as I proposed in 2009).
2. The deadline for mailing should be an election day postmark (which
is the Washington system), thus allowing voters to hear the
last-minute arguments and still cast their ballots without driving
50 miles.
Dan Meek
503-293-9021 dan at meek.net <mailto:dan at meek.net> 866-926-9646 fax
On 11/8/2012 2:03 PM, Thomas J. Cares wrote:
Dan, Salvador, and all,
While I'm familiar with Oregon's system, I was thinking you could take
what California has, but, simply, instead of every voter getting a
"sample ballot" in the mail, they can get an actual ballot.
As someone who opted to be a permanent vote by mail voter in 2009 (and
has never missed an election since - including local-only elections), I
feel like I get a very unfair advantage - with no drawbacks - just
because I (like many - but not most - others) requested it.
I get a ballot in the mail, and I can return it by mail up until the
Friday before election day. Alternatively, I can bring it to any polling
place in my county on election day, and not have to wait at all (when I
voted in person in 11/08, I waited about an hour). And, if I lose the
ballot, or spill a drink on it, I can still vote in person. It gives me
more options, providing for less burden, without me having to concede
anything; it seems unfair that many voters have this advantage, while
most don't, just because they didn't take the affirmative steps to opt
for it.
When I ran for office 3 years ago, I was astonished at how favorably
disproportionate absentee votes were in prior primary and low-turnout
elections in my districts. I don't remember the exact data, but I sent
out emails with the following quote, advising non-absentee voters to
request absentee ballots (it was a special election with an
inevitably-low turnout). I'm sure this paragraph in the email was an
honest reflection of the data I had reviewed:
I'm writing you, this early morning, specifically, to let you
know that, while the election is still about a week away,
there's A DEADLINE, TONIGHT (11:59 pm, 8/25/09), to very-easily
ask the County to send you a ballot in the mail, through a
convenient online form - https://LaVote.net/SECURED/AV
I really wouldn't want you to be without a voice in this
election, and so I didn't want you to unwittingly miss a
deadline to vote in a way that might be far more convenient.
While only about 10 percent of voters choose to receive ballots
in the mail, those 10% traditionally end up casting about
two-thirds of the total votes cast in special elections like
these. Even if you don't actually mail your ballot back, being a
vote-by-mail voter gives you the advantage of be able to return
your ballot, on election day, to ANY polling place, without any
waiting (instead of having to cast a vote at your one assigned
location).
Thomas Cares
On Thu, Nov 8, 2012 at 1:11 PM, Dan Meek <dan at meek.net
<mailto:dan at meek.net>> wrote:
Thomas Cares may assume that in a vote-by-mail system there would be
ballot drop boxes conveniently located for all voters. That is not
the case in Oregon, where in rural areas drop boxes are often 50
miles or more apart.
And why have special ballot drop boxes, when there are hundreds of
millions of regular mail drop boxes in America, including one at
virtually every residential and business address? A better solution
would be Thomas's recommendation of free postage for all ballots,
along with the Washington approach of counting every ballot that is
postmarked on or before election day.
Dan Meek
503-293-9021 <tel:503-293-9021> dan at meek.net
<mailto:dan at meek.net> 866-926-9646 <tel:866-926-9646> fax
On 11/8/2012 11:21 AM, Salvador Peralta wrote:
Tom describes exactly the process that exists with respect to vote
by mail as it is presently conducted in Oregon.
Starting in 2012, the USPS is obliged by its own policies to deliver
ballots regardless of whether the ballots have sufficient postage.
Ballots may be returned via the mail or in person to ballot drop
sites located in the counties in which voters reside.
Voters who lose their ballots may request a provisional ballot at
their local county clerk's office.
On the question of fraud or potential fraud, I would hope that some
of the academics on the list will consider conducting a serious
study on the strengths and weaknesses of VBM as it is conducted in
Oregon and Washington. A study recently posted to the list that
touched on VBM versus in-precinct voting struck me and several of
the folks I shared it with as being remarkably short on actual data.
After reading about the various problems around the country -- long
lines; faulty touchscreen machines; poorly trained poll workers;
potential voter initimidation; voters missing from the rolls in
their precinct; ad hoc policies with respect to the handling of
provisional and absentee ballots, etc. -- I imagine that more states
will look toward vote by mail as an alternative, particularly since
the cost of VBM is substantially less than in-precinct polling.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
*From:* Thomas J. Cares <Tom at TomCares.com> <mailto:Tom at TomCares.com>
*To:* Election Law <law-election at uci.edu> <mailto:law-election at uci.edu>
*Sent:* Thursday, November 8, 2012 10:36 AM
*Subject:* Re: [EL] Line Standers --not just heroic but Hiatoric
I have doubts that any of the five ideas in the WaPo article Rick
link
<http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/ezra-klein/wp/2012/11/08/five-ways-to-cut-long-election-lines/>ed
to would _/dramatically/_ improve wait times.
I wonder if we could do something bigger, like just mail everyone a
vote-by-mail ballot, and have the federal government fully subsidize
return postage for all VBM ballots. Voters could discard the ballots
and vote at the polls as if they'd never received them, or mail
them, or return them to any polling place in their county.
With this, I'd bet less (maybe a great deal less) than one-third of
ballots would actually be filled out at polling places, and that the
overwhelming majority would either mail their ballot or simply drop
it off at a polling place on election day (with the convenience of
being able to go to one near their job, or favorite grocery store,
and not necessarily the one in their home precinct - and not having
to wait!).
I suspect the argument against this would be the potential for fraud
(I'm not sure that's meritorious though; diligent implementation
could probably prevent fraud).
There's a good argument for better early voting policies, but a
disadvantage to early voting is that something may happen in the
last days of the campaigns that could cause an (objective) voter to
change their mind on at least one thing on their ballot (I'm a
permanent vote by mail voter, but whenever I'm certain I'm going to
be in LA County on election day, I hold my ballot until the election
to allow for that contingency). It would certainly seem helpful if
all voters had the automatic option to fill out their ballot at home
and quickly drop it off on election day.
Thomas Cares
On Thu, Nov 8, 2012 at 8:01 AM, Roy Schotland
<schotlan at law.georgetown.edu <mailto:schotlan at law.georgetown.edu>>
wrote:
We haven’t sung enough about the Line Standers, who stand among
the all-time proof of how much people –as grass-roots as can
be-- care about the Right to Vote.
Roy A. Schotland
Professor Emeritus
Georgetown Law Center
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