[EL] smith on cu

Trevor Potter tpotter at capdale.com
Fri Apr 3 10:12:10 PDT 2015 

No, they date back to the Court's first discussion of the issue in Buckley.

Sent from my iPhone

On Apr 3, 2015, at 1:04 PM, Steve Hoersting <hoersting at gmail.com<mailto:hoersting at gmail.com>> wrote:


Am I remembering correctly that "completely" and "wholly" independent are J. Breyer's words for the Court in McConnell?

Have those words been adopted elsewhere? I don't remember.

Those words connote that any sanctuary for IEs is mostly a trap for the unwary, for Breyer and his allies.

Those words, however, will not carry the same freight for Justices who understand that independence is a valid concept -- it creates room to speak -- it is a workable construct; a concept that exists.

Best,
Steve

On Apr 3, 2015 12:54 PM, "Trevor Potter" <tpotter at capdale.com<mailto:tpotter at capdale.com>> wrote:
Of course, the Court was explicitly talking about " independent expenditures"-- which it has repeatedly defined as " completely", " wholly" separate from any candidate or political party. That is what insulates them from corruption and the appearance of corruption. That does not describe the Super Pacs we routinely see today-including " Sen . Reid's Senate Majority PAC"...

Trevor Potter

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 3, 2015, at 12:44 PM, Smith, Brad <BSmith at law.capital.edu<mailto:BSmith at law.capital.edu>> wrote:
>
> See, this is what I mean. I've
>
> Bradley Smith got a couple hundred pages, plus thousands more in other writings. Rick takes 5 words and thinks he's nailed my philosophy.
>
> By the way, if look at the part if CU that Rick quotes, what does the Court say? It says that there is "scant evidence" that IEs create undue gratitude, and that in any case, that is not sufficient to justify regulation. Which was my point.
>
> When I teach I try to point out to my students that they must try to understand what the Court is doing as the Court understands it. Otherwise, they will fail to understand what is going on and fail to make arguments that persuade the court.
>
> When you look at what the court is doing, I think my quote is a pretty good 50 word summary of what the court is doing, and I'm disappointed that ricks response was to impugn my intellectual integrity.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Apr 3, 2015, at 12:14 PM, "Rick Hasen" <rhasen at law.uci.edu<mailto:rhasen at law.uci.edu>> wrote:
>>
>> I get an even greater kick of an argument against literalism in campaign finance law interpretation when this critique comes from a person who ends his book on campaign finance ("Unfree Speech") by reminding us that the First
>> Amendment begins with “Congress shall make no law . . . ”
>>
>>> On 4/3/15 8:10 AM, Smith, Brad wrote:
>>> I get a kick out of the stubborn obtuseness and literalism of people who refuse to understand the court's decisions o. The court's terms.
>>>
>>> Bradley Smith
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>>> On Apr 3, 2015, at 10:51 AM, "Rick Hasen" <rhasen at law.uci.edu<mailto:rhasen at law.uci.edu>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> “Ted Stevens Case Looms Over Menendez Indictment”<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71516>
>>>> Posted on April 3, 2015 7:49 am<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71516> by Rick Hasen<http://electionlawblog.org/?author=3>
>>>>
>>>> Mike Sacks<http://www.nationallawjournal.com/id=1202722424024/Ted-Stevens-Case-Looms-Over-Menendez-Indictment> reports for NLJ.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> [Share]<https://www.addtoany.com/share_save#url=http%3A%2F%2Felectionlawblog.org%2F%3Fp%3D71516&title=%E2%80%9CTed%20Stevens%20Case%20Looms%20Over%20Menendez%20Indictment%E2%80%9D&description=>
>>>> Posted in chicanery<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=12>, direct democracy<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=62>
>>>> “In a Short Time, Ted Cruz Has Raised Big Money From Small Donors”<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71514>
>>>> Posted on April 3, 2015 7:44 am<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71514> by Rick Hasen<http://electionlawblog.org/?author=3>
>>>>
>>>> NYT’s The Upshot reports.<http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/03/upshot/what-ted-cruzs-early-fund-raising-means-and-doesnt.html?ref=politics&abt=0002&abg=1>
>>>>
>>>> [Share]<https://www.addtoany.com/share_save#url=http%3A%2F%2Felectionlawblog.org%2F%3Fp%3D71514&title=%E2%80%9CIn%20a%20Short%20Time%2C%20Ted%20Cruz%20Has%20Raised%20Big%20Money%20From%20Small%20Donors%E2%80%9D&description=>
>>>> Posted in campaign finance<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=10>
>>>> “Interim Report on Voting Equipment Performance, Usage & Certification”<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71512>
>>>> Posted on April 3, 2015 7:33 am<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71512> by Rick Hasen<http://electionlawblog.org/?author=3>
>>>>
>>>> From Virginia<http://elections.virginia.gov/WebDocs/VotingEquipReport/1.pdf> (more here)<http://elections.virginia.gov/webdocs/VotingEquipReport/>.
>>>>
>>>> [Share]<https://www.addtoany.com/share_save#url=http%3A%2F%2Felectionlawblog.org%2F%3Fp%3D71512&title=%E2%80%9CInterim%20Report%20on%20Voting%20Equipment%20Performance%2C%20Usage%20%26%20Certification%E2%80%9D&description=>
>>>> Posted in election administration<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=18>, voting technology<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=40>
>>>> “A Skewed Electoral Field”<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71510>
>>>> Posted on April 3, 2015 7:29 am<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71510> by Rick Hasen<http://electionlawblog.org/?author=3>
>>>>
>>>> Rob Richie<http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/03/opinion/a-skewed-electoral-field.html> NYT letter to the editor.
>>>>
>>>> [Share]<https://www.addtoany.com/share_save#url=http%3A%2F%2Felectionlawblog.org%2F%3Fp%3D71510&title=%E2%80%9CA%20Skewed%20Electoral%20Field%E2%80%9D&description=>
>>>> Posted in electoral college<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=44>
>>>> “Fresh Questions About ‘Coordination’ Rules”<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71508>
>>>> Posted on April 3, 2015 7:28 am<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71508> by Rick Hasen<http://electionlawblog.org/?author=3>
>>>>
>>>> Bauer<http://www.moresoftmoneyhardlaw.com/2015/04/fresh-questions-coordination-rules/> on Brickner on Gilbert.
>>>>
>>>> [Share]<https://www.addtoany.com/share_save#url=http%3A%2F%2Felectionlawblog.org%2F%3Fp%3D71508&title=%E2%80%9CFresh%20Questions%20About%20%E2%80%98Coordination%E2%80%99%20Rules%E2%80%9D&description=>
>>>> Posted in campaign finance<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=10>
>>>> #SCOTUS Didn’t Mean It When They Said It Dep’t<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71506>
>>>> Posted on April 3, 2015 7:25 am<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71506> by Rick Hasen<http://electionlawblog.org/?author=3>
>>>>
>>>> Brad Smith<http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/03/us/politics/robert-menendez-indictment-points-to-corrupting-potential-of-super-pacs.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&module=second-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=1> trying to recast the holding of Citizens United in the NYT:
>>>>
>>>> “The court’s position is pretty simple, and it is not that independent expenditures can never create gratitude in an officeholder,” said Bradley A. Smith, a professor of law at Capital University Law School. “Rather it is that as a constitutional matter, they do not pose a threat of corruption sufficient to justify the invasions of First Amendment rights that the ‘reformers’ crave.”
>>>>
>>>> Here’s what the Court actually said in Citizens United<http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?court=US&vol=000&invol=08-205>:
>>>>
>>>> The McConnell record was “over 100,000 pages” long, McConnell I, 251 F. Supp. 2d, at 209, yet it “does not have any direct examples of votes being exchanged for . . . expenditures,” id., at 560 (opinion of Kollar-Kotelly, J.). This confirms Buckley‘s reasoning that independent expenditures do not lead to, or create the appearance of,quid pro quo corruption. In fact, there is only scant evidence that independent expenditures even ingratiate. See 251 F. Supp. 2d, at 555-557 (opinion of Kollar-Kotelly, J.). Ingratiation and access, in any event, are not corruption.
>>>>
>>>> I explain how the Court significantly narrowed the definition of corruption in Citizens United in my Michigan Law Review article, Citizens United and the Illusion of Coherence<http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=1620576>. It is a trend that was extended from expenditures to contributions in last year’s McCutcheon case.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> [Share]<https://www.addtoany.com/share_save#url=http%3A%2F%2Felectionlawblog.org%2F%3Fp%3D71506&title=%23SCOTUS%20Didn%E2%80%99t%20Mean%20It%20When%20They%20Said%20It%20Dep%E2%80%99t&description=>
>>>> Posted in campaign finance<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=10>, Supreme Court<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=29>
>>>> “Gov. Scott’s criticism of online voter registration angers counties”<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71504>
>>>> Posted on April 2, 2015 4:17 pm<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71504> by Rick Hasen<http://electionlawblog.org/?author=3>
>>>>
>>>> News<http://www.tampabay.com/blogs/the-buzz-florida-politics/scotts-criticism-of-online-voter-registration-angers-elections-officials/2223877> from FL.
>>>>
>>>> [Share]<https://www.addtoany.com/share_save#url=http%3A%2F%2Felectionlawblog.org%2F%3Fp%3D71504&title=%E2%80%9CGov.%20Scott%E2%80%99s%20criticism%20of%20online%20voter%20registration%20angers%20counties%E2%80%9D&description=>
>>>> Posted in Uncategorized<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=1>
>>>> “The Menendez Case Proves the Supreme Court Was Naive About Campaign Finance Laws”<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71502>
>>>> Posted on April 2, 2015 4:10 pm<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71502> by Rick Hasen<http://electionlawblog.org/?author=3>
>>>>
>>>> Christian Farias writes<http://www.newrepublic.com/article/121446/menedez-corruption-case-exposes-supreme-court-naivete> for TNR.
>>>>
>>>> [Share]<https://www.addtoany.com/share_save#url=http%3A%2F%2Felectionlawblog.org%2F%3Fp%3D71502&title=%E2%80%9CThe%20Menendez%20Case%20Proves%20the%20Supreme%20Court%20Was%20Naive%20About%20Campaign%20Finance%20Laws%E2%80%9D&description=>
>>>> Posted in campaign finance<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=10>, Supreme Court<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=29>
>>>> “Robert Menendez Indictment Points to Corrupting Potential of Super PACs”<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71500>
>>>> Posted on April 2, 2015 4:09 pm<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71500> by Rick Hasen<http://electionlawblog.org/?author=3>
>>>>
>>>> NYT reports.<http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/03/us/politics/robert-menendez-indictment-points-to-corrupting-potential-of-super-pacs.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&module=second-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0>
>>>>
>>>> [Share]<https://www.addtoany.com/share_save#url=http%3A%2F%2Felectionlawblog.org%2F%3Fp%3D71500&title=%E2%80%9CRobert%20Menendez%20Indictment%20Points%20to%20Corrupting%20Potential%20of%20Super%20PACs%E2%80%9D&description=>
>>>> Posted in campaign finance<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=10>
>>>> Michael Boos on @99Rise: “Do As I Say, Not As I Do”<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71498>
>>>> Posted on April 2, 2015 4:07 pm<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71498> by Rick Hasen<http://electionlawblog.org/?author=3>
>>>>
>>>> The following is a guest post from Michael Boos, Vice President and General Counsel of the group Citizens United:
>>>>
>>>> The group 99Rise made headlines earlier this week when several of its members disrupted proceedings at the U.S. Supreme Court in a protest over the Supreme Court’s recent campaign finance law rulings, including Citizens United v. FEC. This wasn’t the first time, the group disrupted the Supreme Court. Last year, several of its members, including co-founder Kai Newkirk, pulled off a similar stunt. There’s even of videotape of Newkirk yelling: “Money is not speech. Corporations are not people.” 99Rise’s anti-corporate theme appears throughout its promotional materials, including on its website, where it calls for a constitutional amendment to “ensure that neither private wealth nor corporate privilege could be used to exercise undue influence over elections and policy making.”
>>>>
>>>> While 99Rise and its spokespersons rail against corporations, nowhere on its website or in its promotional materials does the group or its leaders disclose a critical fact – 99Rise is the very embodiment of the corporate form that it so readily condemns. According to filings with the California Secretary of State’s office, 99Rise is a consortium of two corporate entities – 99Rise National Support Center, which was incorporated on August 7, 2014, and 99Rise Action, which was incorporated on October 14, 2014. And both corporate entities share the same registered agent – Noah Kai Newkirk – the anti-corporate protester who disrupted the Supreme Court.
>>>>
>>>> But there’s more. 99Rise solicits contributions on its website, where the contribution page tells would be contributors: “Contributions are tax-deductible.” This, of course, implies the group is a California charity. Nevertheless, according to the California Attorney General’s charities website, none of the 99Rise organizations are registered with that office to solicit contributions for charitable purposes
>>>>
>>>> 99Rise, a group that’s clearly the personification of “Do As I Say, Not As I Do.”
>>>>
>>>> Michael Boos
>>>>
>>>> Vice President & General Counsel
>>>>
>>>> Citizens United
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> [Share]<https://www.addtoany.com/share_save#url=http%3A%2F%2Felectionlawblog.org%2F%3Fp%3D71498&title=Michael%20Boos%20on%20%4099Rise%3A%20%E2%80%9CDo%20As%20I%20Say%2C%20Not%20As%20I%20Do%E2%80%9D&description=>
>>>> Posted in campaign finance<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=10>
>>>> “Don’t like ‘dark money’ in your politics? This guy could help stop it with a pen.”<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71496>
>>>> Posted on April 2, 2015 10:05 am<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71496> by Rick Hasen<http://electionlawblog.org/?author=3>
>>>>
>>>> Michael Keegan oped<http://blogs.reuters.com/great-debate/2015/04/01/how-obama-could-help-solve-the-dark-money-problem/> at Reuters.
>>>>
>>>> [Share]<https://www.addtoany.com/share_save#url=http%3A%2F%2Felectionlawblog.org%2F%3Fp%3D71496&title=%E2%80%9CDon%E2%80%99t%20like%20%E2%80%98dark%20money%E2%80%99%20in%20your%20politics%3F%20This%20guy%20could%20help%20stop%20it%20with%20a%20pen.%E2%80%9D&description=>
>>>> Posted in campaign finance<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=10>
>>>> “A compromise in Connecticut; Registrars and Merrill reach consensus on reform legislation”<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71494>
>>>> Posted on April 2, 2015 9:31 am<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71494> by Rick Hasen<http://electionlawblog.org/?author=3>
>>>>
>>>> That’s the lead story in this week’s Electionline Weekly<http://www.electionline.org/index.php/electionline-weekly>.
>>>>
>>>> [Share]<https://www.addtoany.com/share_save#url=http%3A%2F%2Felectionlawblog.org%2F%3Fp%3D71494&title=%E2%80%9CA%20compromise%20in%20Connecticut%3B%20Registrars%20and%20Merrill%20reach%20consensus%20on%20reform%20legislation%E2%80%9D&description=>
>>>> Posted in election administration<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=18>
>>>> “Thanks to Obama, the New World of Campaign Finance Is Unlimited and Undisclosed”<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71492>
>>>> Posted on April 2, 2015 8:53 am<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71492> by Rick Hasen<http://electionlawblog.org/?author=3>
>>>>
>>>> Bloomberg Politics.<http://www.bloomberg.com/politics/articles/2015-04-02/thanks-to-obama-the-new-world-of-campaign-finance-is-unlimited-and-undisclosed?cmpid=BBD040215&utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_term=The%20Brief&utm_campaign=Politics%20Newsletter%20-%20April%202%2C%202015>
>>>>
>>>> [Share]<https://www.addtoany.com/share_save#url=http%3A%2F%2Felectionlawblog.org%2F%3Fp%3D71492&title=%E2%80%9CThanks%20to%20Obama%2C%20the%20New%20World%20of%20Campaign%20Finance%20Is%20Unlimited%20and%20Undisclosed%E2%80%9D&description=>
>>>> Posted in campaign finance<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=10>
>>>> “Delaying your candidacy doesn’t mean you can avoid campaign finance rules”<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71490>
>>>> Posted on April 2, 2015 8:53 am<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71490> by Rick Hasen<http://electionlawblog.org/?author=3>
>>>>
>>>> FEC Chair Ann Ravel oped.<http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/if-it-walks-like-a-candidate-and-talks-like-a-candidate-/2015/03/31/87a91a14-d490-11e4-8fce-3941fc548f1c_story.html>
>>>>
>>>> [Share]<https://www.addtoany.com/share_save#url=http%3A%2F%2Felectionlawblog.org%2F%3Fp%3D71490&title=%E2%80%9CDelaying%20your%20candidacy%20doesn%E2%80%99t%20mean%20you%20can%20avoid%20campaign%20finance%20rules%E2%80%9D&description=>
>>>> Posted in campaign finance<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=10>, federal election commission<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=24>
>>>> “America’s ‘Menendez’ problem: How big money poisons politics — and how it can be fixed”<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71488>
>>>> Posted on April 2, 2015 8:52 am<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71488> by Rick Hasen<http://electionlawblog.org/?author=3>
>>>>
>>>> Stephen Spauling oped<http://www.salon.com/2015/04/02/americas_menendez_problem_how_big_money_poisons_politics_and_how_it_can_be_fixed/> in Salon.
>>>>
>>>> [Share]<https://www.addtoany.com/share_save#url=http%3A%2F%2Felectionlawblog.org%2F%3Fp%3D71488&title=%E2%80%9CAmerica%E2%80%99s%20%E2%80%98Menendez%E2%80%99%20problem%3A%20How%20big%20money%20poisons%20politics%20%E2%80%94%20and%20how%20it%20can%20be%20fixed%E2%80%9D&description=>
>>>> Posted in campaign finance<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=10>
>>>> “Senator Robert Menendez — possibly corrupt, definitely bad at using AmEx reward points”<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71486>
>>>> Posted on April 2, 2015 8:42 am<http://electionlawblog.org/?p=71486> by Rick Hasen<http://electionlawblog.org/?author=3>
>>>>
>>>> LOL.<http://www.vox.com/2015/4/2/8333447/menendez-amex>
>>>>
>>>> [Share]<https://www.addtoany.com/share_save#url=http%3A%2F%2Felectionlawblog.org%2F%3Fp%3D71486&title=%E2%80%9CSenator%20Robert%20Menendez%20%E2%80%94%20possibly%20corrupt%2C%20definitely%20bad%20at%20using%20AmEx%20reward%20points%E2%80%9D&description=>
>>>> Posted in chicanery<http://electionlawblog.org/?cat=12>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Rick Hasen
>>>> Chancellor's Professor of Law and Political Science
>>>> UC Irvine School of Law
>>>> 401 E. Peltason Dr., Suite 1000
>>>> Irvine, CA 92697-8000
>>>> 949.824.3072<tel:949.824.3072> - office
>>>> 949.824.0495<tel:949.824.0495> - fax
>>>> rhasen at law.uci.edu<mailto:rhasen at law.uci.edu><mailto:rhasen at law.uci.edu<mailto:rhasen at law.uci.edu>>
>>>> http://www.law.uci.edu/faculty/full-time/hasen/
>>>> http://electionlawblog.org
>>>> <share_save_171_16.png>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Law-election mailing list
>>>> Law-election at department-lists.uci.edu<mailto:Law-election at department-lists.uci.edu>
>>>> http://department-lists.uci.edu/mailman/listinfo/law-election
>>
>> --
>> Rick Hasen
>> Chancellor's Professor of Law and Political Science
>> UC Irvine School of Law
>> 401 E. Peltason Dr., Suite 1000
>> Irvine, CA 92697-8000
>> 949.824.3072<tel:949.824.3072> - office
>> 949.824.0495<tel:949.824.0495> - fax
>> rhasen at law.uci.edu<mailto:rhasen at law.uci.edu>
>> http://www.law.uci.edu/faculty/full-time/hasen/
>> http://electionlawblog.org
> _______________________________________________
> Law-election mailing list
> Law-election at department-lists.uci.edu<mailto:Law-election at department-lists.uci.edu>
> http://department-lists.uci.edu/mailman/listinfo/law-election
>


<115040312511304325>

_______________________________________________
Law-election mailing list
Law-election at department-lists.uci.edu<mailto:Law-election at department-lists.uci.edu>
http://department-lists.uci.edu/mailman/listinfo/law-election
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 This email has been scanned for email related threats and delivered safely by Mimecast.
 For more information please visit http://www.mimecast.com
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://webshare.law.ucla.edu/Listservs/law-election/attachments/20150403/dd4798d4/attachment.html>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: 115040312511304325
Type: image/png
Size: 9617 bytes
Desc: 115040312511304325
URL: <http://webshare.law.ucla.edu/Listservs/law-election/attachments/20150403/dd4798d4/attachment.png>
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: 115040313121300657
Type: image/png
Size: 9617 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: <http://webshare.law.ucla.edu/Listservs/law-election/attachments/20150403/dd4798d4/attachment-0001.png>

View list directory